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Herald which afhrmed distinctly that the bill sider the vote by which an amendinent to the offered loy the gentleman from New York [Mr. third section of the Ariny bill offered by the Conkling] was a more perfect bill than the one gentleman from Maine [Mr. BLAINE] was which had been presented by the chairman ofthe adopted yesterday. committee on the bankrupt law; that it was such
EVIDENCE IN CONTESTED ELECTIONS. a bill as.could not be picked to pieces in debate;
The SPEAKER laid before the House evithat it was a bill which embodied all the legal acumen of the House, and a bill which the dence in the contested-election cases of Boyd author of the paragraph thought would cer:
against Kelso and Koontz against Coffroth; tainly pass. It seemed to me that, under the
which was referred to the Committee of Elec
tions. circumstances, gross injustice was done by that paragraph to the gentleman from Rhode Isl
And then, on motion of Mr. RANDALL, of and; and upon exhibiting the paper to various Pennsylvania, the House (at four o'clock and members of the House, they concurred with thirty minutes p. m.) adjourned. me in that opinion, and agreed with me that the injustice should be corrected. I went to
PETITIONS, ETC. the gentleman from New York [Mr. Raymond]
The following petitions, &c., were presented under and pointed out specifically the points wherein the rule and referred to the appropriate committees: I deemed gross injustice was done to the gen By Mr. DELANO; The petition of James Colvin, tleman from Rhode Island, and I asked of him
Thomas Black, and 1.000 others, wool-growers of
Muskingum county, Ohio, praying for an increase the privilege of making in his paper a correc of duty on forcign wools imported into the United tion of that paragraph, solely for the purpose States,
Also, the memorial of James Cather, trustee and of vindicating, as I conceived, the merits and
deacon of the Baptist church at Glenville, Gilmer the ability of the gentleman from Rhode Isl.
county, West Virginia, praying indemnity for tho and. I stated to the reporter of the Times the use of the church property by United States troops. facts of the case, to wit, that the gentleman
Also, the petition of John Kugler, for indemnity
for use of property at Camp Dennison, Ohio, by Unifrom New York,' [Mr. CONKLING,] who had ted States military authority. voted against the bill of the gentleman from By Mr. HITCHCOCK: The petition of citizens of Rhode Island, had subsequently introduced
Nebraska, praying for just and equal laws for regu
lation of inter-State insurances. that identical bill.
By Mr. JULIAN: The petition of J. R. Daily, I did not make this statement with the inten charging fraud and mismanagement on the part of
the American Colonization Society, and asking retion of placing the gentleman from New York
lief. invidiously before the country in any respect; By Mr. KETCHIAM: The memorial of General C. I was unconscious of being animated by any H. Van Wyck, of Orange county, New York, asking motives inimical to him; and if the result of
that pensions may be increased and the laws so mod
ified that persons entitled thereto may obtain the my interference in this matter and the making same with less delay and perplexity than at present. of these statements to the reporter has either Also, tho memorial of General C. H. Van Wyck, injured his feelings or prejudiced him before
asking that three light guns, captured at Duigle's
Mills, South Carolina, in April, 1805, may be deposthe public, I wish to make this public disa ited at Washington's headquarters, at Newburg, vowal of any such intention, and to tender him New York.
By Mr. KELLEY: The memorial of 18 officers of an apology:
the State Legislature of Pennsylvania, praying your Mr. RAYMOND. Mr. Speaker, if the House
honorable body to protect the wool-growers of the will indulge me a moment
United States, by imposing a duty of ten cents per The SPEAKER. Is there any objection
pound and ten per cent. ad valorem on all unwashed
foreign wools competing with American wools, the to the gentleman from New York making a value avhereof at the last port of export, including personal explanation?
charges in such port, shall be thirty-two cents or less There was no objection.
per pound; and that a duty of twelve cents per pound
and ten per cent.ad valorem be levied on all like wool, Mr. RAYMOND. I desire merely to ac the value whereof, including charges in port, shall knowledge the courtesy and kindness which exceed thirty-two cents per pound; and that theabove have prompted the gentleman from Connecti
rates of duties be doubled on washed wools, and
trebled on scoured wools. cut Mr. DEMING] to make the explanation Also, the memorial of 25 members of the State Senwhich he has just made.
ate of Pennsylvania, praying your honorable body to In the colloquy which took place yesterday
protect the wool-growers of the United States by im
posing a duty of ten cents per pound and ten percent. between my colleague [Mr. CoxKLING] and all vulorem on all unwashed foreign wools competing my self, I did not feel at liberty to go any
with American wools, the value whereof at the last further than I did in disavowing any respon
thirty-two cents or less per pound; and that a duty sibility for the paragraph which appeared in of twelvecents per pound and teri per cent. ad valorem the Times, because I did not wish directly or be levicd on all like wool the value whereof, includindirectly to draw into the affair any gentleman
ing charges in port, shall exceed thirty-two cents per
pound; and that the above rates of duties be doubled without having had previous consultation with on washed wools, and trebled on scoured wools. him. I feel obliged to the gentleman from Also, the memorial of 82 inembers of the LegislaConnecticut for stating what is the simple fact,
ture of Pennsylvania, praying your honorable body
to protect the wool-growers of the United States by that I had nothing whatever to do with origi. imposing a duty of ten cents per pound and ten per nating, inspiring, composing, or printing that
cent. ad valorem on all unwashed foreign wools com
peting with American wools, the value whereof at the paragraph.
last port of export, including charges in such port, Now, if the House will indulge me one mo shall be thirty-two cents or less per pound; and that ment longer, I beg to say that my position here
a duty of twelve cents per pound and ten per cent. ad
valorem bo levied on all like woor, the value whereof, in a twofold capacity, as a member of Congress including charges in port, shall exceed thirty-two and as the editor of a newspaper, puts me some
cents per pound; and that the above rates of duties times in an embarrassing posture. I am quite bedenkled on washed wools, and trebled on scoured ready always at the proper time and in the Also, the petition of 16 citizens of Meadville, Pennproper place to be responsible to anybody for sylvania, praying your honorable body for a further anything I may say or do. I beg to add that I protection to the wool-growers of the United States do not think the floor of Congress a proper place
by imposing a duty of ten cents per pound and ten
per cent. ad valorem on all unwashed foreign wools for making an explanation or for taking respon competing with American wools, the value whereof sibility for things said or done; and hereafter
at the last port of export, including charges in such
port, shall be thirty-two cents or less per pound; and I wish it distinctly understood while I will on that a duty, of twelve cents per pound and ten per the floor respond to any gentleman for anything
cent, ad valorem bo levied on all like wool, the value I may say here, I will not hold myself subject
whereof, including charges in port, shall exceed
thirty-two cents per pound; and that iho above rates to being questioned. I will not hold myself of duties be doubled on washed wools, and trebled on bound to answer any question which may be
scoured wools. put to me here upon this floor for what I may
Also, the memorial of 28 distillers and dealers in
domestic spirits in the city of Philadelphia, Pennsylsay or do or what may be said or done in the vania, respectfully representing that the exaction of columns of the New York Times. I will answer personal security for the payment of duties on spirits in the columns of the New York Times, when
deposited in general bonded warehouses entirely out
of the hands of the owner is, in effect, a heavy tax addressed as editor of the New York Times, for upon trade without any substantial advantage to the anything I may say or do in that capacity. revenue, but, on the contrary, will have a tendency
to diminish it by driving out of business all but the RECONSIDERATION OF A VOTE.
wealthiest houses. Your petitioners, therefore, pray Mr. MARSTON entered a motion to recon
your honorable body for the passage of a law requiring the simple obligation of the party storing spirits
to pay the dutiesbefore removing, in licu of the bonds now required by law.
Also, the memorial of 59 members of the bar, practiring in the Federal courts at Pittsburg, Per psylvania, respectfully remonstrating against the passage of the bill to reorganize the Federal judiciary, now before the Senate of the United States, for the following reasons, &c.
Also, the petition of 51 citizens and wool-growers of Allerhany county, Pennsylvania, praying your honcrable body to impose a duty of ten cents per pound and ten per cent. ad valorem on all unwashed foreign wools competing with American wools, the value whereof at the last port of export, including charges in such port, shall be thirty-two cents or less per pound; and that a duty of twelve cents per pound and ten per cent. ad valorem be levied on all liko wools, the valuo whereof, including charges in port, shall exceed thirty-two cents per pound; and that the above rates of duties be doubled on washed wools, and trebled on scoured wools.
By Mr. LAWRENCE, of Pennsylvania: A petition, numerously signed by citizens of Lawrence county, Pennsylvania, asking an increase of duties on foreign wools.
By Mr. MARSTON: The petition of William James, and others, of Portsmouth, New Hampshire, praying that the recommendation of the Secretary of the Navy, that $192,000 be paid to the officers and crew of the Kearsarge for the destruction of the Alabama, be carried into cffcct.
Also, the petition of Micajah Lunt, and 33 others, for the same object.
By Mr. MCKEE: The petition of 600 soldiers of the tenth, fortieth, and forty-fifth Kentucky volunteers, asking a bounty equal to $100 per year be paid them for the time they served in the United States Army.
By Mr. MOORHEAD: A petition from citizens of Pittsburg, Pennsylvania, praying for the passage of a law to permit steamboats to carry gunpowder when packed in keus made of iron.
By Mr. VORRIS: Four petitions, numerously signed by citeens and wool-growers of the twentyfitb congressional district of New York, asking for an increase of duty on imported wool.
By Mr, PAISE: The petition of S. Kidder, and 135 others, citizens of Salem, Kenosha county, Wisconsin, for increase of tariff on foreign wools.
Also, the petition of John J. Myrick, and 59 others, citizens of Lyons, Walworth county, Wisconsin, for increase of duty on foreign wools.
Also, the petition of s. s. Derbyshire, and 76 others, citizens of Pleasant Prairie, Kenosha county. Wisconsin, for an increase of tariff on foreign wools.
Also, the petition of James Bonnell, and 35 others, individuals and firms of Milwaukee, for the enacta ment of a Federal insurance law.
Also, the petition of Thomas C. Williams, and 18 others, citizens of Yorkville, Racine county, Wisconsin, for increase of duty on foreign wools.
Also, the petition of Thomas Dale, and 23 others, citizens of Yorkville, Racine county, Wisconsin, for increase of tariff on foreign wools.
Also, the petition of Delos Hale, and 35 others, citizens of Ocenomowoc and Summit, Wisconsin, for the enactment of a Federal insurance law.
Also, the petition of Aretas Bailey, and 65 others, citizens of Caldwell's Prairie, Racine county. Wisconsin, for increase of duty on foreign wools.
By Mr. RAYMOND: The petition of Charity, mother of Stephen W. Weed, killed at Gettysburg to be placed on the pension-list.
By Mr.SMITH: A petition from the Board of Trade of the city of Lonigville, Kentucky, praying Congress to purchase the Oakland grounds near that city, and the Government property thereon, for the purposo of establishing a cavalry depot school of instruction.
By Mr. WASHBURNE, of Illinois: The petition of Charles S. Burt, and others, of Illinois, manufacturers of agricultural implements, for reduction of the tax on the same.
By Mr. WINDOM: The petition of J. H. Holland, and 63 others, citizens of Morristown, Rice county, Minnesota, asking for the passage of a law equalizing soldiers' bounties.
By Mr. WOODBRIDGE: The petition Z. II. Cunfried, and 66 others, citizens of Arlington, Bennington county, Vermont, for an increased protection to American wool.
Also, the petition of John Balis, and 37 others, citizens of Benson, Rutland county, Vermont, praying for an additional protection on foreign wool.
Also, the petition of Asa Collins, and 27 others, citizens of Chittenden, Rutland county, Vermont, prayfor additional duty on foreign wool.
Also, the petition of Henry C. Gleason, and 40 others, citizens of Shrewsbury, Rutland county, Vermont, praying for an increase of duty on foreign wool.
Also, the petition of Hiram Jones, and others, citizens of Waitstield. Washington county, Vermont, praying for an additional duty on foreign wool.
Also, the petition of Boswell Bottum, and 103 others, and Charles Bacon, and 60 others, for same purpose.
Also, the petition of II. B. McLure, and 42 others, citizens of Middletown, Rutland county, Vermont, praying for an increased duty on wool,
Also, the petition of James Rice, and 38 others, citi- * zens of Powlet, Rutland county, Vermont, praying for an increase of duty on imported wool.
Also, the petition of Seneca Root, and others, citizens of Ilubbardton, Rutland county, Vermont. prayfor an increased protection to American wool.
Also, the petition of Nathaniel Sherman, and others, citizens of Plainfield and Marshfield, Washington county, Vermont, praying for an additional duty on wool.
Also, the petition of Emory H. Clark, and 42 others, citizens of East Cabot, Washington county, Vermont, praying for an increase of the tariff upon the importations of foreign wools into this country.
Mr. HOWARD, from the Committee on Sioux Indians and the other Indians iapon the WEDNESDAY, April 18, 1866.
the Pacific Railroad, to whom was referred a upper Missouri and the upper Platte for
memorial of citizens of Iowa, remonstrating several years at a very great expense, but Prayer by the Chaplain, Rev. E. H. Gray. The Journal of yesterday was read and
against any diversion of the funds, and against that last tall the military authorities, under approved.
any legislation that would be injurious to the instructions both from the War Department
extension of the Dubuque and Sioux City rail and the Interior Department, entered into EXECUTIVE COMMUNICATIONS.
road, asked to be discharged from its fur arrangements to bring about peace between The PRESIDENT pro tempore laid before ther consideration, and that it be referred to the United States and those various bands. the Senate a report of the Commissioner of the Committee on Public Lands; which was With several of these bands of Sioux treaties Agriculture, communicating, in compliance with agreed to.
have already been made and peace has been a resolution of the Senate of the 13th instant, Mr. GRIMES, froin the Committee on Naval | effected. The War Department, or those having information in relation to the rinderpest or cattle Affairs, to whom was referred a joint resolution charge of our military operations, it seems, plague; which was referred to the Committee (H. R. No. 197) to provide for the better organ have invited the Indians of several other bands on Agriculture, and ordered to be printed. ization of the pay department of the Navy, to meet at several of the forts of the UniHe also laid before the Senate à report of reported it with an amendment,
ted States with a view to negotiate treaties of the Secretary of the Interior, communicating, in obedience to law, copies of the accounts of
peace and amity with those bands, and the Superintendent Sells and Agents Snow and Mr. RIDDLE asked, and by unanimous con
Secretary of War called upon General Curtis
to make estimates of what would be necessary Dunn, of the southern Indian superintendency, sent obtained, leave to introduce a bill (S. No.
in the negotiation of those treaties, as the Indifor the fourth quarter of 1865, with a copy of 271) to authorize a special tax for the purpose
ans are brought together generally in bands the report of the Commissioner of Indian Af of improving the Washington city canal ; which
and brought together almost entire; and the fairs on the subject; which was referred to the was read twice by its title, referred to the Com
Government of the United States, while they Committee on Indian Affairs. mittee on the District of Columbia, and ordered
are together and during the pendency of the to be printed. PETITIONS AND MEMORIALS.
negotiation, is compelled to furnish supplies Mr. HOWARD. I present the petition of obtained, leave to introduce a bill (S. No. 272)
He also asked, and by unanimous consent Mrs. Abby Green, formerly of Richmond, Vir
to them. The War Department called upon to authorize the corporation of Washington to General Curtis to make an estimate, and he ginia, praying for the passage of a bill for her
reduce the width and improve the avenues and relief on account of services rendered and losses
made an estimate to the Secretary of War, and incurred in behalf of the Union cause at Richstreets of that city; which was read twice by
it seems that at the time the Secretary of War, its title, referred to the Committee on the Dismond, Virginia, from August, 1863, to Febtrict of Columbia, and ordered to be printed supplies to attend to this matter, so informed
supposing that they had sufficient rations and ruary, 1864. I beg to state in regard to this
Mr. McDOUGALL asked, and by unanipetitioner that she assisted Mrs. Quarles very
General Curtis. I'read from his letter : mous consent obtained, leave to introduce a materially in rescuing Colonel Streight and his bill (S. No. 273) to authorize the President to
“The Secretary of War informed me that the arti
cles necessary to make up these supplies at the variparty from imprisonment at Richmond. I-ask
convey to William P. Rogers and his associates ous points would be sent forward immediately." that it may be referred to the Committee on
the island of Yerba Buena, or Goat Island, in It seems that on a communication from GenClaims.
the harbor of San Francisco; which was read eral Pope to General Grant and to the Mar It was so referred. twice by its title.
Department that the War Department has not Mr. WADE. I present the memorial of Sue
Mr. McDOUGALL. I desire simply to ob these supplies to furnish. The Indians are Murphy, and various documents in proof of
serve that when this bill was first placed in my invited to assemble and the time is fixed, but her claiin, setting forth that she was the owner
hands I had great doubts of its propriety, but the military authorities are without the supplies of a house near Chattanooga which was ordered to be taken down for the purpose of erecting informed, I think it is a bill to the profit of the after looking at it carefully and being better | necessary to feed them during the pendency of
the negotiations, and the matter is now thrown fortifications upon the spot where it was built.
Government. I move that it be referred to the on the Interior Department, and the Interior The memorial is strongly recommended by Committee on Military Affairs and the Militia. Department have asked a special appropriation many officers, and among them those who
The motion was agreed to.
from Congress to meet these expenditures, ordered it destroyed. She claims to have been a loyal person. I move that the memorial and
sending forward the estimates by items of what accompanying documents be referred to the Mr. JOHNSON submitted the following res
the expenditures must necessarily be at each
of these forts where the Indians have been Committee on Claims.
olution ; which was considered by unanimous invited to assemble. The motion was agreed to. consent, and agreed to:
Mr. BROWN. Where are the forts? Mr. HENDERSON presented additional Resolved. That the Committee on the Library be Mr. DOOLITTLE. Fort Sully, Fort Rice, papers in relation to the claim of William C.
instructed to inquire into the expediency of purchas-
Fört Berthold, Fort Union, and Fort Laramie, Anderson ; which were referred to the Com cdition of the Constitution: Provided, That the com five different places. I have received a committee on Claims.
pilation be brought down to the present time on the munication from the Commissioner of Indian Mr. KIRKWOOD presented a petition of same plan.
Affairs to the Secretary of the Interior of the citizens of Iowa, praying for the enactment of
ARMY BREVET APPOINTMENTS.
12th instant, and I will read a portion of it to such just and equal laws for the regulation of
Mr. SHERMAN submitted the following | the Senate: inter-State insurances of all kinds, as may be resolution; which was considered by unani
“I have the honor to acknowledge the receipt of effectual in establishing the greatest security mous consent, and agreed to:
your letter of the 20th instant, inclosing copies of for the interests protected by policies, and pro Resolved, That the President of the United States correspondence between your Department and the motive of the greatest good and convenience be requested to communicate to the Senate, if not
Secretary of War in relation to the subsistence of to all concerned in such transactions; which incompatible with the public interests, the proceed
Indians about to assemble in council at Fort Lara. ings of the military board recently convencd in St.
mic and at various points on the upper Missouri was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary. Louis, Missouri, in relation to brevet appointments
river, and instructing me to make estimates of what Mr. WILSON presented two petitions of in the regular Army.
supplies may be needed to provide for the occasion,
adding transportation and subsistence for the comofficers of the United States Army, praying NEGOTIATION OF INDIAN TREATIES.
missioners. for an increase of their pay; which were
*I hare also to acknowledge the receipt of your let. referred to the Committee on Military Affairs
Mr. DOOLITTLE. By direction of the Com ter of the Ath ultimo, inclosing a communication
mittee on Indian Affairs a joint resolution, mak from Major General Pope, of March 16, with vouchers and the Militia.
ing an appropriation to enable the President for services rendered by Big Ribs' and party, sent KEPORTS OF COMMITTEES.
as messengers to the hostile Indians; and by referto negotiate treaties with certain Indian tribes,
ence from your Department of another communicaMr. LANE, i Indiana, from the Committee was introduced by me yesterday and laid upon tion from Major General Pope, of the 21st ultiino, on Pensions, to whom was referred a joint res the table, and I stated that I should move to
inclosing voucbers of presents made to said Dig
Ribs,' the whole amounting to $5,456 11, which you olution (H. R. No. 46) for the relief of Martha take it up this morning. It is very important instruct me to embrace in my estimate of the required McCook, asked to be discharged from its further | that we should have immediate action on the appropriation. In conformity with tbesc instructions, cousideration, and that it be referred.to the subject, and I now move that that resolution
I have prepared the desired estimate, but wish to call
your attention to the within copy of a letter from Committee on Military Affairs and the Militia ; || be taken up.
Major General S. R. Curtis, adılressed to this oflice, which was agreed to.
The motion was agreed to; and the Senate, and dated March 2, 1860, in which he states that in He also, from the same committee, to whom as in Committee of the Whole, proceeded to
compliance with instructions from the honorablo
Secretary of War, he had mado estimates and requiwas referred a bill (H. R. No. 463) for the re consider the joint resolution (S. R. No. 69) sitions on the War Department for the necessary ralief of James Foster, reported it adversely, and making an appropriation to enable the Presi tions to feed these Indians, and for transportation of asked to be discharged from its further consid dent to negotiate treaties with certain Indian
said subsistence to Fort Larannie and other places of
treaty rendezvous in the upper Missouri country, eration; which was agreed to.
tribes. It proposes to appropriate $121,785 77, and that the Secretary of War had intormed him that He also, from the same committee, to whom or so much thereof as may be necessary, to 'the articles necessary to make up these supplies were referred the following bills, reported them enable the President to negotiate treaties with
at the various points would be sent forward immedi
a tely.' severally without amendment:
the Indian tribes of the upper Missouri and "In view of the fact that the Indians referred to A bill (II. R. No. 464) for the relief of John Platte rivers, to be expended by the Commis were called together by the military authorities in Gordon; sioner of Indian Affairs under the direction
the carly part of last winter, while the commissioners
could not meet them until summer, their subsistence A bill' (H. R. No. 460) granting a pension to of the Secretary of the Interior.
by the War Department seemed to me perfectly just Spencer Kellogg; and
Mr. DOOLITTLE. Mr. President, it is well and proper, and I placed implicit reliance on the A bill (H. R. No.371) to grant a pension to known that hostilities have been going on
assurance given by the honorable Secretary of War
as above stated. It now, however, appears that as Leonard St. Clair.
between the United States and the bands of late as the 24th ultimo Major General Popo telegraphs
from St. Louis to Lieutenant General Grant that he servant who would take hold of this whole mat Indian Affairs contemplate treaties with Indian trusts the Interior Department is making proper ter and transfer the Indian Bureau to the War tribes with whom we have not been at war, and arrangements for focding the numerous bands of Indians assembling at Fort Laramie and on the up
Department, or organize some other mode of if so, why do we propose to treat with those per Missouri river, adding that the military authori treating with Indian tribes than treating them particular tribes that we are already at peace ties have not the means to meet euch extraordinary like foreign nations. The idea of getting to with? demands outside of their legitimate province; and that if the Indians are under the charge of the Inte
gether the head men of the Indian tribes and Mr. DOOLITTLE. Well, Mr. Presidentrior Department that Department should take care giving them pork and beans-very sensible Mr. MCDOUGALL. The Senator from Wisof such matters, and not depend on the military. ** The Secretary of War, in his letter of the 25th
articles of food-feeding them up and then consin will allow me. ultimo, sends you a copy of the above telegram, and
negotiating a treaty with them, and bringing Mr. DOOLITTLE. Yes, for a moment. I referring to a conversation in Cabinet meeting, desires that treaty in here to be ratified as a high nego will refer to some papers have here, and to be informed what measures have been taken by
tiation with a foreign Power, has always seemed answer the Senator from Iowa. your Department to provide for the Indians about to assemble in council.
to me so ridiculous that I hope some time or Mr. McDOUGALL. I have known, probaIn your reply of the same date you state that no other the Senate will abolish the whole system. | bly, more of the Indians that traverse our Rocky arrangements whatever had been made, as you did These Indians will be gathered together as a mountains and the regions further west than not understand the Secretary to say definitely at Cabinet meeting that his Department could not fur
grand conclave, they will have a Fourth of July || any of my colleagues here in the Senate. I nish the subsistence for the purpose referred to, but celebration for about two or three weeks, and have known Indians from my boyhood. The would communicate with you in writing on the sub
they will sign anything presented to them by policy of the Government in dealing with them, ject. "A final communication from the honorable the
the Indian agents. This $121,000 will be used I think, has always been wrong. I agree with Secretary of War, in reply to the above and bearing as a corruption fund-not improperly by the the Senator from Ohio altogetherin that respect. the same date, concludes the correspondence on the
officers of the Government, but it will be used | They must be whipped into their place, and subjcci; the Secretary stating that he designed the conversation at Cabinet meeting as final and to the to make these Indians feel good while it lasts, || subjected to obedience. Why should not the point, but as you appear to have not so understood and then the agent sent there to negotiate a Indian earn his bread by the sweat of his brow? the patter,' ho adds. You will please consider the
treaty will write out what he pleases and they || Why should he not do it with his bow and arrow, application for supplies from the War Department as definitely answered in the negative, for the reason
will sign it, without any knowledge of what is or other material that he may possess? Why that they cannot be furnished under legal authority, contained in it, and if they are satisfied with should he be supported by the Government? nor without prejudice to the military service.
the terms of it afterward, well and good; if It is false legislation, and it is one of those "I have thus reviewed the correspondence in connection with the facts of the case in order to show not, they will take up the tomahawk and the things that oppress the men who do honest labor that no blame can be justly attached to this Depart ritle and commence a war, if they are incited to in the country—that labor which supports our ment for not havingai an earlier date made necessary it by white men.
Government. It is wrong. I have been oppreparations for the assistance called for."
That mode of dealing with the Indians has | posed to it as a matter of policy always, and I By some mistake it was supposed-General | always seemed to me so ridiculous that I never take occasion now to give expression to my Curtis so understood it, and it was so under: had any patience in examining these matters. thought. I met a lot of Choctaws last nightstood by the Secretary of War-that the War But if the Senate still insists on that policy of and I can talk Choctaw-three chiefs who flutDepartment would send on the supplies to feed negotiating treaties with the Indian tribes, the tered in their peacock feathers. We buy thein these Indians during these councils and to pro Committee on Indian Affairs must take the those feathers, and we buy them their blankets. vide what was necessary to be done in the nego- || responsibility for this appropriation, because Why should we do it? I have never been able tiation of these treaties; but subsequently, on the Committee on Finance to whom these pa to find that out by any logical deduction. We further examination, it seems the War Depart pers were rrferred have never yet had time to do not owe them anything but this: we should ment cannot do it; at all events, they decline to examine them; nor has the proper occasion protect them on their hunting grounds. That do it, and the matter is thrown upon the Inte arrived when we could examine them. It || I am prepared to do always, and let them die rior Department, and we must make this appro would have been our duty, of course, to exam ont by a law established by a greater Master priation; otherwise these Indians are called ine the details of these estimates if the Indian than confines himself to this sphere, as another together at these councils and there will be no
appropriation bill had come to us before this race that inhabit about the District of Columbia provision made for them while they are there, time and an amendment had been proposed to is to die out. No man can suggest a good logiand it may result in further hostilities and that bill to meet this object. I have not even cal reason why we should subsist the Indians. trouble.
read these papers; my attention has been just | My friend from Wisconsin, who is a western Mr. President, I have stated the circumstances .this moment called to the fact that the whole man, and who is acquainted somewhat with the under which this application is made. It came subject was referred to the Committee on Fi subject, cannot advance a reason why we should to the attention of the Committee on Indian nance. I shall therefore take no responsibility subsist them; tax our farmers and laboring Affairs yesterday, and it was urged by the Com as to the amount involved or as to the necessity men, and our mechanics, to subsist the Indian, missioner of Indian Affairs and by the Secre of the appropriation.
to come down here and parade his feathers in tary of the Interior that we should take imme Mr. DOOLITTLE. The Indian appropria- || Washington, and draw our blankets. It cannot diate action because of the immense distance tion bill will probably not be here until the be done ; it is not within the range of logic. that these provisions and supplies have to be last of the session, and the 20th of May is the I am, therefore, against the whole policy. transported, and because the period fixed, as time fixed for the Indians to meet and for the Mr. RAMSEY. This war commenced with I understand, for the assembling of the Indians | supplies to be at Fort Laramie, Fort Rice, Fort the Issanti Sioux, in Minnesota, numbering is the 20th of May, and no time should be lost. Sully, and Fort Union on the upper Missouri, || about six or seven thousand. It extended then I therefore hope the resolution will pass at once. and Fort Berthold.
to the Yanctoni Sioux, in the northern part of Mr. SHERMAN. I need not remind the Mr. SHERMAN. I ask by jvhat authority | Dakota, and also to a part of the Yancton Sioux, Senate that I have always opposed appropri- || these tribes are to be convened.
in southern Dakota, and also to the larger part ations for Indian treaties on the ground that I Mr. DOOLITTLE. It was upon this author of the Teton Sioux west of the Missouri, comhave always been opposed to this mode of deal- || ity: we were at war with them, and the military prising the Blackfeet and other bands, so that ing with Indians. Besides that, my attention || authorities, under the direction of the War the whole Sioux tribe on the plains are demoralis now called to a letter of the Secretary of the Department and the Interior Department, the ized and infected with this war spirit. I do not Interior to the Committee on Finance to whom President of course being responsible, invited see how entire peace and quiet can be restored this subject properly belongs, and to whom the these tribes to treat. When my friend from to the frontiers unless through some treaty estimates for the negotiation of new treaties Ohio speaks of the estimates sent to the Finance arrangement. It may require a little money, are generally sent to be included in the Indian Committee I am inclined to think that he is but surely appropriation bill, and they are generally ex looking at the estimates to carry into effect * Mr. MCDOUGALL. Let me ask the Senmined by the Committee on Finance. I have treaties already ratified.
ator, would it not be better to whip them well? in my hands a large number of estimates con Mr. SHERMAN. No.
Mr. RAMSEY. Certainly it would, if you taining the details of this sum of one hundred Mr. GRIMES. Are these tribes that we have could catch them, but that is the great difficulty. and twenty-one thousand and odd dollars. · It | been at war with?
Mr. McDOUGALL, Is not the Government is a sum extraordinarily large. Indeed, the Mr. DOOLITTLE. Some of them are. powerful, and hasit not men and horses enough? largest sum I ever remember to have been ap Mr. GRIMES. We have been at peace with Mr. RAMSEY. On those immense plains propriated for making an Indian treaty is about
in Dakota, and on the Platte, it is impossible twenty thousand dollars. This is $121,785. Mr. DOOLITTLE. We have been at war for any armed force you can send there to overWe have not had time or occasion to examine with the Sioux and the Black feet. In relation take them. these documents in detail, because the Indian to the time I wish to say a word.
Mr. McDOUGALL. If you furnish General appropriation bill has not yet come to the Sen Mr. GRIMES. I wish to make an inquiry || Sully the horses and men, he will hunt them 'ate. These papers would have been examined of the Senator. As I understand it, we have to the death. by us at the time we received them but for the not been at war with many of these Indians Mr. RAMSEY. But that would take ten fact that we supposed they were intended to that it is proposed to treat with. There may times as much money as this treaty arrangeapply to the Indian appropriation bill which have been additional murders or atrocities per ment will cost. Besides, there are large bodies has not yet come to us. Now, unless the Sen- petrated by some of them; but my impression of these Sioux that you cannot possibly reach; ator from Wisconsin can satisfy the Senate that is that we have treated with most of those Indi our men cannot get at them; they live on the there is pressing and urgent necessity for action ans with whom we have been at war.
British frontier. All of the Issanti Sious, the on this appropriation, I do not see why we Mr. DOOLITTLE. We have not treated most hostile and most bloody ofall the Dakotas, should pass a separate bill. It is unusual to with them all.
now live on the northern border, and after comMy own opinion is that some Senator Mr. GRIMES. What I want to know is this: mitting depredations retreat across the line, and would distinguish himself as a valuable public ll does not the chairman of the Committee on you cannot follow them. They keep poisoning
the minds of other bands of Sioux. I do not under the direction of the President, throngh country where he was born, westward and vestsee how it is possible to restore peace on the the instrumentality of the War Department, ward still, crowded by the progress of high civ. frontier unless we can do it by some treaty with several bands of these Sioux Indians. ilization. I do not think that wrong. I think arrangement of this kind.
The expense is They were fed by the War Department, and it is one of the provisions of the Master that nothing in comparison with the object to be Congress never heard anything about it. Why thus it should be so. It is pleasant to me to accomplished.
not? Because it was paid for out of the funds think that the country that I properly inhabit Mr. McDOUGALL. There can be no peace of the commissary department and the quar is now occupied by the Caucasian race, and it restored among the Indians on our frontier termaster's department, and we never knew there masters. It must happen so, for there is except by compelling them to obedience. anything about it. But now, when the War a progression of races, and that progression we
Mr. RAMSEY. The trouble is to catch Department say they have not the funds and have seen through all ages, from the Pelasgi them. I admit that the Senator is right in that, cannot furnish the commissary supplies any
and the fair-haired men from the North who but it is impossible, on these immense plains, llonger, the Interior Department must furnish came down from old Scandinavia and made the to catch these bands of Indians. We have had || supplies to these very Indians whom the War heroes of Greece and then in Rome; they who a large number of troops operating against them Department have invited into council to see conquered, debilitated, and demoralized Italy. for years, but they have very rarely been able if we can have peace with them; and when All these things indicate that there is a proto overtake the Indians.
the Interior Department presents its estimates | gression of races. I would not willingly injure Mr. McDOUGALL. They were never well before Congress and we look into them, they one of the race who inhabited our country when mounted.
appear to be very large. The sum to be ap the first white man landed on these shores. I Mr. RAMSEY. The great difficulty is in propriated here is $121,000, but it is not for a am partial to the Indian race. I was taught carrying provender for your horses on these single treaty. The Indians are invited to meet in my childhood by the Oneidasimmense interior wastes. at five different posts, hundreds of miles from The PRESIDENT
pro tempore. The mornMr. DOOLITTLE. Mr. President, there is each other, some on the upper Platte, some on ing hour having expired, it becomes the duty. but one way to deal with these Indians on the the upper Missouri. I suppose they will assem of the Chair to call up the unfinished business plains: you must feed them or fight them. ble, and if they assemble, and the War Depart of yesterday. There is not much honor to be won by the ment is not prepared to feed them during the Mr. DOOLITTLE. I ask that the order of Army or by the Government in fighting with | assembling, what shall be done with them? If the day may lie over informally until we can these Indians. Compared with us, they are a we do not make this appropriation, the Inte. come to a vote on this resolution. very feeble people. We are strong; we are a rior Department cannot furnish them sup The PRESIDENT pro tempore. If no obgreat nation. They are wandering nomads | plies. If they come together at our invitation | jection be made, the order of the day will be over the plains, with no more habitation than and then disperse, they will regard it as a kind || informally laid aside, and the joint resolution the buffalo has. They go with the buffalo, and of breach of faith on our part to invite them which was under discussion will still be conwh the buffalo goes. They live upon the | together in this way to negotiate for a treaty | sidered as before the Senate. buffalo, and with the buffalo, and range over and make no provision for them while they are Mr. DOOLITTLE. I do not wish to take those vast plains. The honorable Senator from there.
up any further time; but I have before me the California suggests that we should by military I admit that abuses creep into the Indian letter of General Curtis in which he states the power reduce them to subjection and compel department, as is the case in every depart number of Indians that are expected to asseinthem to obedience. Whenever we meet them ment where money is to be expended. Abuses ble at these different posts: at Fort Laramie, we can conquer them and capture and slaugh creep in from the infirmity of human nature. twenty-five hundred ; at Fort Sully, two thouter them, but it is just as impossible, within Men are tempted to take advantage of the sand; at Fort Rice, two thousand; at Fort any reasonable amount of expenditure, to catch Government on contracts.
Men are some Berthold, two thousand; at Fort Union, twentythese Indians and reduce them to obedience times tempted to defraud the Government; | five hundred. It will be seen, therefore, that by war as it is to catch the buffalo upon the and in dealing with the Indians perhaps the || there are two thousand Indians and upward to plains or the blackbirds that fly over the plains. || temptation may be stronger, if the Indians are assemble at each one of these posts, and thereSir, the proposition to organize great military the only witnesses of their transactions. But fore I think the estimate is not an extravagant expeditions with artillery, to go through these after all it is much cheaper for us to deal with immense plains and to carry provender for the Indians in this way than it is to deal with Mr. NESMITH. I look upon this as a horses, where every bushel will cost you from them by arms. I say to my honorable friend matter of very great importance, and I hope three to five and even ten dollars to feed the from California that I think there is just as we shall have the immediate action of the Sen. horses on which you ride, is a proposition to much honor, and a great deal more humanity, ate upon it. It is very well understood that put the finances of the Government into a in feeding and blanketing and making presents during the last season great efforts were made bottomless pit.
to these Indians than there is in chasing them to reduce the Indians of the upper Missouri I know it costs something to keep these over the plains and slaughtering them, with and from there to Montana to some state of Indians together and feed them; it costs some their wives and children. hope that this subjection or of peace. They had given great thing to make treaties with them. My friend resolution will pass.
annoyance to travelers and settlers in Dakota from Ohio smiles at the idea of a treaty with an Mr. WILSON. How much does it appro and Minnesota as well as on the overland route. Indian tribe. He thinks the thing is ridiculous | priate?
The energies of the Government were directed on its face. Compared with a treaty with Great Mr. DOOLITTLE. One hundred and last summer to their subjugation. Failing in Britain, I admit it is a very trivial affair; but twenty-one thousand dollars to pay the ex that, it was deemed by the military officers and so long as human nature is composed of those penses of their assembling at five different the officers brought in contact with those peoelements which dwell even in the breast of an posts. Some two thousand are expected at ple that it was better to inaugurate some sysIndian as well as a white man, by manifesta one place; fifteen hundred at another, fifteen tem by which a treaty could be made with tions of friendship, by kind treatment, by pres. hundred at another, &c.
them, that it would be cheaper for the Governents, by feeding them, you can have peace with Mr. McDOUGALL. I do not dispute the ment and better for all parties concerned that them better than by fighting with them, and at point of present judgment with the Senator some amicable arrangement should be made a hundredth part of the expense.
from Wisconsin, the chairman of the Commit which should secure peace on the frontier Mr. MCDOUGALL. Let me ask the Sena tee on Indian Affairs, whose particular busi and on the plains. The energies of the officers tor, is not that a policy to continue the contro ness it is to understand the present question. of the Army and other Government officials versy with them for many years, and will it not Indeed, I think he is altogether right in the who were brought in contact with them last be in the end more expensive?
present statement of what he desires to have year were directed to that purpose. The result Mr. DOOLITTLE. We have been at war done by the Government. I think he is alto was that arrangements were made whereby with these Sioux since 1862. I have no doubt | gether wrong, though, in the philosophy of his large numbers of them are to assemble early the expenditures of the Government in prose policy. The remarks that I made some few this spring for the purpose of concluding temcuting wars against the Sioux, on these plains, ipinutes since were designed rather to express porary treaties formed by the military who were have amounted to over thirty million dollars. my view of what should be the policy than what in that country last summer. There is a difference between making appro. might be the proper thing now to be done. I Under that arrangement it is expected that priations to the Interior Department to feed | understand that our Government through its within a few days large numbers of these peoIndians, and making appropriations to the War proper officers has invited, for treaty purposes, ple will be assembled at different points. They Department to furnish the commissary depart the Sioux Indians north of forty-five degrees come with the express guarantee and underment, or the transportation department with into council. This having been done, it should standing on the part of the Government offi; supplies. You come into Congress with an be exactly executed, for the faith of the Gov cials that certain supplies shall be furnished estimate from the War Department for com ernment is involved in it. My remarks, when them while there. We may question the right missary supplies, and in a single bill of appro I rose before, were directed to the permanent of the officers to make this pledge in advance; priation you will appropriate $400,000,000 per- || policy, not the present action. Those Indians but that is a point of which an Indian has no haps, all in one iminense fund, which is drawn having been assured that we will treat with very correct comprehension. When he meets upon by the War Department at will; and so it | them, and having been invited to meet us, they a Government official and he pledges himself is with the quartermaster's department; the must be treated as they have been treated here to do a certain thing, he regards that as the appropriation is all made in one vast sum." But tofore.
pledge of the Government. The Indian does when we come to ask for appropriations for the I only wish to say now that I desire to have not comprehend that the officer may not be Interior Department, you go into the items and done with that policy. I do not think that we authorized to make pledges in advance whereby take them up one case at a time.
have been out of the order of life or nature large sums of money shall be disbursed before Now, we have negotiated several treaties, ll because the Indian has retroceded from the Il appropriation bills are passed by Congress.
That is a matter that cannot be brought to the and what these Senators on the Committee on certain. It is after all an experiment. We are comprehension of the Indian. He treats with Indian Affairs have not yet told us, is, who | dealing with a feeble people, with a dying peothe officer and looks upon him as one fully au authorized the assembling of these Indian | ple; they will soon pass away, and nothing will thorized to enter iato and make these arrange tribes. I have looked in these papers, and I remain of the Ind in tribes but the beautiful ments; and when a failure comes to carry out cannot tell who did it. Was it the Secretary names which they gave to our rivers and our the provisions or stipulations made between of the Interior, anticipating an appropriation towns. This is to be their inevitable destiny; that officer and the Indian, the Indian is bound from Congress? I see nothing to show that. but while they are passing along like sick chilto look
it as a species of bad faith exer Did the Commissioner of Indian Affairs under dren on our hands, it is better to deal in the cised on the part of the Government, and conse take to make six new treaties with some ten spirit of humanity, to feed these dying people, quently he considers himself justified in resort thousand hostile Indians without authority of than it is to turn in and slaughter them by the ing to hostilities for what he considers the bad | law? If not, who did it? Or was it left to sword. That is my settled conviction from all faith of the Government.
some wandering Indian agent or superintend the information I have been able to obtain in The view in which the Indian looks upon ent of Indian allairs ?
relation to Indian matters. this matter is that the Government is pledged Mr. DOOLITTLE. Allow me to state on Mr. SHERMAN. If these Indians had been to certain things, and the certain things to that subject the facts. During the last year convened by the President of the United States which it is pledged are set forth in detail in hostilities were prevailing all over the plains. | in pursuance of his executive authority to ne. this report of the Commissioner of Indian General Curtis was in command, General Sully gotiate a treaty of peace and during a war, I Affairs. It is an estimate showing all the de being with the expedition far northwest, Gen- have no doubt it is the duty of Congress to aptails, all that is necessary to carry out sub eral Dodge down on the Arkansas. It will be propriate money to carry into effect the execustantially the temporary treaties which were remembered by my honorable friend that a tive order. Undoubtedly the President of the formed last year and to meet the Indians this committee was appointed on the part of Con United States has the power to negotiate peace spring, as was understood and arranged be gress last year to inquire into Indian affairs ; with warring nations. If these Indian tribes tween the oflicers of the Government and the and the gentleman who now sits in the chair, are warring nations, as they seem to be considIndians at that time. It provides for large [Mr. Foster,] myself, and other gentlemen, ered, as a matter of course he has the power to bodies of Indians being assembled at each were appointed upon that committee. When negotiate a treaty of peace with them and subplace; for instance, fifteen hundred Indians we were upon the upper Arkansas, we were mit it to the Senate for approval at the proper are notified to assemble on the 20th of May at decidedly of the opinion that it was better to time. The only question that arises then would Fort Sully; then, again, fifteen hundred more make peace with these Indians than it was to be as to the best mode of meeting the expendiare notified to assemble on the 1st of June at carry on this system of warfare, which was so ture. As far as I understand the Senator from Fort Rice; at Fort Berthold fifteen hundred enormously expensive and produced such very Wisconsin, the assistance and transportation Indians are notified to assemble on the 20th of little results so far as the capturing of any of
have been heretofore furnished by the proper June; and at Fort Union two thousand Indians the Indians was concerned. We pressed the bureaus of the War Department, and now, for are notified to assemble on the 5th of July; || consideration of it upon the President, the Sec the first time, it is proposed to introduce into at Fort Laramie two thousand Indians are retary of War, and the Secretary of the Inte the Indian Office transportation and subsistnotified to assemble on the 20th of May, and rior. They had consultations here in answer ence of provisions.
These different assemblages have to to our communications to them by telegraph Mr. DOOLITTLE. What I desired to say be provided for. The Indians have been and otherwise; and we received telegraphic was, that in dealing with these tribes in the notified that they are expected to assemble communications from them in return; and upon treaties which were negotiated by. General there in pursuance of the negotiations which full consultation in the Cabinet with the Presi Curtis and by General Harney, the.War Dehave been had with them. They are doubtless | dent, it was determined to enter upon a system | partment had furnished the supplies; the Intenow on the way to these different points of of negotiation of peace with the tribes instead rior Department had not done it; and the rendezvous; and if this appropriation fails to of carrying on hostilities. All the military Interior Department now supposed that the pass, I apprehend that we shall have a repeti- || commanders were so directed by the Secretary War Department would furnish these, until tion of the scenes of bloodshed, outrage, mur of War and the Secretary of the Interior, upon from a letter received from the Secretary of der, and plunder which have been going on instructions that were agreed upon between the War the Secretary of the Interior is informed for the last two years in that country.
Secretary of War and the Interior Department, that the War Department cannot do it, and The urgency for the passage of this resolu with the sanction of the President. Commis the thing is thrown on the Interior Departtion consists in this fact that the Indians being | sioners were appointed to negotiate treaties of ment, and the Interior Department must take on the way to the different points of rendez: || peace in the Indian country and up the Arkansas. the responsibility of doing it; otherwise, the vous it is impossible to wait until the general Among those who were appointed to nego Indians are invited to meet at these places, and appropriation bill can pass Congress to carry tiate treaties on the upper Arkansas were Gen there are no supplies and we do not get peace out the objects contemplated by this resolution | eral Harney, who is famous among the Indians with them. It is a new cause of irritation and and by this detailed statement which I now as a great general in fighting them, and Kit a new cause of war, and that is just the exihold in my hand. If we delay it until that time Carson, who was equally famous. In negotia- ) gency and the necessity pressing upon the the period will have long passed when the Indi ting the treaties on the Platte and north of the Interior Department for our action, and our ans shall have assembled and this distribution | Platte in Dakota, General Curtis, who had been immediate action. Supposing that the War of supplies should have taken place among in command of the department, was employed Department would furnish the supplies to them. Therefor for the preservation of peace as one of the commissioners, and he entered these Indians as they had furnished them to in that vast region of country, and in view of into those treaties that have been already con the others, the Interior Department took no the objects which the military officers report firmed. Other gentlemen were with him, Gen steps to procure these appropriations until can probably be accomplished-the making of eral Sully and General Sibley, the very officers At all events, this is the first request a permanent peace there and preventing a of the Army who had had most to do with those that came to the Indian Committee on the recurrence of hostilities hereafter-I urge on Indians and knew the Indians best, and as I subject. I do not know but that those estithe Senate the adoption of the resolution. On understand it General Curtis is the one who mates that went to the Finance Committee an examination of the details of the estimates, || invited these Indians to these councils. Gen may have gone in some weeks ago. I do as submitted by the Secretary of the Interior eral Curtis, as I understand, is to go out at the not know when they went to that committee ; and the Commissioner of Indian Affairs, I think head of the commission with a view of nego but the matter first came to the Indian Comthey will be found most reasonable, and the tiating the very treaties which they are invited mittee yesterday, and with the urgent request sum is not so large as to excite any very great to make. This has all been done with the full on the part of the Department that we should apprehensions on the part of Congress or of sanction both of the War Department and the take immediate action, because it was necesihe country if we are to realize what I appre Interior Department and with the express sanc sary to purchase these supplies immediately hend we shall from this general negotiation-a tion of the President, and I may say upon the at St. Louis in order to send them up the restoration of peace on the frontiers and on urgent recommendation of those gentlemen who Missouri river or get them transported to the the plains.
were connected with that congressional com place of meeting, which is already fixed, with Mr. RAMSEY. In addition to the other mittee to look into Indian affairs; and I have these Indians. considerations which have been urged here on no doubt that if you carry out the policy and
Mr. SHERMAN. I do not intend to press behalf of this appropriation, I desire to men carry it through of negotiating treaties, and if any opposition to this appropriation, because tion the fact that at this time many thousands we comply with our treaties in good faith and I am deficient of information to do so; but the of our people are passing up the Missouri river; H give them the supplies which we promised, the facts disclosed this morning show clearly, I many boats have already left St. Louis on their blankets and provisions which we promised, we think, that the Indian Bureau ought to be way up to Montana; two thousand miles of that may have peace with them at a tithe of the transferred to the War Department, or all route are through this hostile country; and expense of dealing with them by the sword. connection with the Indians transferred to the these Indians, as the Senator from Oregon has These are the facts.
Interior Department. That is manifest from said, will look upon the failure to furnish these I know, as my honorable friend knows, that the statements which have been made. Here supplies as a breach of faith on the part of the dealing with these Indians is a very different is confusion between these two Departments Government; and if our commissioners do not thing from dealing with a great nation like Eng: of the Government; neither seems to undermeet them with the supplies, they will seek land or France; and of all the committees, I stand its appropriate duties in this respect. revenge on the people going up there; and no doubt not, in the Senate of the United States, The bill of items submitted to the Commit. inan can tell what destruction of life and prop there is no committee that has so difficult a task tee on Finance is so singular that since I have erty will ensue.
to manage and get along with as this very In read it this morning for the first time it strikes Mr. SHERMAN. What I wish to get at, dian Committee; dealing with them is so un me as furnishing a very strong argument why