showing consideration to those who by the operation of this Act would be deprived of situations, the Government would be bound to consider what would have to be done in such a case, having regard of course to the public interest. The clause was passed. On the 36th clause relating to convict labor, Sir JOHN A. MACDONALD asked if the Government had any policy as to letting out convict labor by contract. The present authorities disapproved very generally of this system. Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE said the Government had not decided upon any policy. Some tenders had been received up to a recent time, but had not been accepted for the reason that the Government were to consider, when the House rose, what was to be done in this matter. A great deal had been said on the care exercised by the contractors. The system worked well at the Central Prison at Toronto, but was liable to interruption from the failure of contractors or some cause in the business that might interrupt | the whole work of the prison. In that respect perhaps it would be better if the Government were to adapt prison labor to such works as they could. The whole subject was to be reviewed by the Government after the session. Sir JOHN A. MACDONALD was glad to hear the statement of his hon. friend. He believed the prison labor could be made profitable under proper surveillance if the right contractors could be found; but no amount of supervision could prevent some contractors from interfering with the moral improvement of the prisoners by giving them tobacco and spirits as a bribe to greater exertions in working. While it was important that the prisoners should be made to sustain themselves, it was still more important that they should be reformed if possible. Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE said he had an idea, which was not yet clearly defined, of employing the labor of convicts in carrying on the public works of the country. It was quite possible they might be able to manufacture the greater portion of the rolling stock required on the great railroads about to be constructed. That was one reason why he desired to locate the prisons in the Lower Provinces on some convenient place on the Intercolonial Hon. Mr. Mackenzie. Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE said before recess he desired to call attention to the remarks of the hon. member for Kingston regarding the report of Mr. PLUMB'S speech. He (Mr. MACKENZIE) had always found reporters eminently fair where they were not directed by some. parties in the interests of particular newspapers. There was an esprit de corps amongst all reporters that dictated fair reports, and hon. members must often have felt greatly indebted to the reporters for improving their speeches. In this particular speech it so happened that the reporters had taken a verbatim report of every part of Mr. PLUMB's speech. He (Mr. MACKENZIE) could not conceive how it came to be stated that there was no report of it taken. The editor of the Hansard had sent him a copy of the report, and if the hon. member for Niagara could see the manuscript, he would no doubt find that his speech had been accurately reported. No time should be lost in correcting the erroneous impression that the reporters had been unfair towards Mr. PLUMB. It would, he was sure, be as gratifying to the hon. member from Kingston as it was to himself to learn that there was no ground for complaint against the reporters. MAC Right Hon. Sir JOHN DONALD said he had received a letter from the clitor of the Hansard stating that a full report had been taken of Mr. PLUMB's speech. He (Sir JOHN) had nothing more to say, but he might explain that his attention had been called, while the debate was going on, to the fact that the reporters at the table had not even pencils in their hands. The fact was noticed by at least twenty gentlemen on the Opposition side of the House. was surprised to learn that a full report had been taken, though no mortal hand was employed in the work at the table, during the whole hour the hon. gentleman was speaking. He Mr. MILLS mentioned the fact that only one reporter took notes at a time, though there were generally two or three CERTIFICATES TO MASTERS AND MATES. Hon. Mr. SMITH moved the House into Committee to consider the following resolutions 1. That it is expedient so to amend the Act respecting certificates to masters and mates of ships as to make it apply to ships over eighty tons register, and to ships going to sea on a voyage to any port or place out of Canada. 2. That it is expedient to make provision for the examination of masters and mates of inland and coasting ships, as regards ships of over eighty tons register, and voyages com menced after the first day of April, 1876. The House went into Committee:-Mr GIBSON in the chair. Hon. Mr. SMITH, in reply to Mr. WOOD, said that the Bill would apply to steamships as well as sailing vessels. The Committee having reported the resolution, Hon. Mr. SMITH introduced a Bill founded thereon, intituled: "An Act to amend the Act respecting certificates to masters and mates of ships." The Bill was read the first time. SPEEDY TRIALS. On motion of Hon. Mr. FOURNIER, police and stipendiary magistrates, in the the Bill for the more speedy trial before with felonies or misdemeanors was read a Province of Ontario, of persons charged second time, and referred to the Committee of the Whole :-Mr. TROW in the chair. The Committee rose and reported the Bill, which was read a third time and passed. COPYRIGHTS. two years Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE moved the. second reading of the Bill from the Senate,. respecting copyrights. He said it was known that the Royal assent was refused to the Bill passed ago, on account of representations made by authors and publishers in England. During the recess he had interviews with some delegates representing English authors and publishers, and with several English authors, and he had received a draft bill from the Imperial Government which contained their views respecting this very complicated matter. The Bill now before the House was one that he thought embodied very nearly all that had been seriously demanded by authors and publishers; while it afforded a fair scope for Canadian publishers, providing as it did for the publication of works if within a certain time the authors did not take out a copyright or commence publication. He believed this Bill was acceptable to Canadian publishers, and it might the Royal sanction for which, of course, it fairly be presumed that it would receive would be reserved. Mr. DYMOND said he felt obliged to to the merits of this Bill. In his judgdissent from the hon. Premier with respect ment it would be better to have the law as it stood at present. He did not propose to delay the progress of the Bill at this stage, but he asked that time be given after the second reading for its further consideration. Before its final passage he would like to have an opportunity of offering a few remarks upon it. Hon. J. H. CAMERON thought it would be better if his hon. friend wished to dissent from this Bill, for him to make The Committee reported the Bill, and his remarks now. The subject of copyit was read a third time and passed. right had engaged the attention of our Mr. Mills. now. Hon. Mr. HOLTON said that it was almost too much to ask any member of the House to be prepared to make a lengthened speech after the labors of the last forty-eight hours. It would, perhaps, be better to defer the second reading of this measure; but if that was not done he thought that no further stage should be taken to-night and that another opportunity should be given for a full discussion. Legislatures for the past quarter of a cen- | which took place on this resolution a few tury, but unfortunately no Bill that has evenings ago, and he had promised that passed has ever received the Royal assent. when it came up for concurrence, he would He believed that the present measure was state what the Government proposed to do one that would be likely to receive the in relation to it. There was a manifest, Royal assent, and that it was satisfactory and he was bound to say not unreasonable, to authors and publishers on both sides of hostility to the Government taking a the Atlantic. However, if the hon. mem- vote of one million dollars for a work, ber for North York knew of any difficul- the exact cost of which, and the extent to ties in the way of its being accepted in which they might be able to proceed this England, he thought he should state them year, they were not able to state. He proposed now to reduce this amount to a mere nominal sum sufficient to enable them to proceed to make such further surveys as might be necessary to get the most complete information. They proposed to invite tenders and have an estimate prepared from them when the House met again, showing the cost of the work. They also proposed to take such steps as would secure as accurate information as possible of the value of the work in a commercial sense, so that they might be able to meet the House with some statistical information showing the real value of this work to the country at large. He was not insensible to the fact, or what might be supposed to be a fact, that local consideration might have had some influence, both with those opposed to and in favor of the scheme. He was not able himself from any information he had at hand to form any judgment as to what the real value of the work would be to Canada; but the Government would use all the means in their power to be able to present to the House next session an intelligent estimate of the commercial value of this work, its cost, and the means they thought should be taken when that was ascertained in order to complete the work or otherwise. He, therefore, moved that this item be not concurred in, but that it be reduced from $1,000,000 to $20,000. Mr. DYMOND said he had only received the Bill after it finally passed the Senate this afternoon. It not merely opened the question of copyright, but also the right of the people of Canada to manage their own affairs. While he would be glad to see a measure passed that would be acceptable to authors and publishers in England, he felt that his first duty was to this country, and while he did not hope to effect any change in the Bill, he wished to have an opportunity of placing his views on record in order to further the discussion which he had the honor of raising in this House a year ago. To his mind it was very doubtful whether this Bill would receive the Royal assent. Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE observed that perhaps upon the whole it would be desirable, as was proposed to have a discussion on that Bill, that it should take place on the second reading. For his part he not only had no objection to a discussion, but rather invited one, and as it would be preferable to have it on the second reading, he begged leave to withdraw his motion. Motion withdrawn. BAIE VERTE CANAL. On the order for the further consideration of resolution 83 in the estimates Baie Verte Canal, $1,000,000, Hon. Mr. TUPPER said he could not state that he was very much surprised at the announcement which had just been made by the Minister of Public Works, but he did think that the Government occupied a position that was very far from enviable in relation to this question. The First Minister knew that this great work was brought under the consideration of Parliament in connection with the whole canal policy, as proposed by the Canal Commission which was composed of the the first commercial That policy was sub Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE said the Gov-ablest engineers and ernment had considered the discussion men in the country. Hon. J. H. Cameron. mitted to the House as a whole, and was gested the propriety of spending the money accepted by the House as a whole. Was required for this work in some other way. the House in that sincere or insincere? The policy of the Government as announced Did the First Minister intend at that in the first instance, was to invite tenders time to assent apparently to this impor- so as to ascertain the cost of the work, and tant work in order to secure the construc- whether that cost would be such as would tion of works in which he himself took a warrant them in proceeding with it, but more immediate interest? Did the House the hon. member for South Bruce was not intend after they had accepted the policy willing to trust the Government of the of the Canal Commissioners as a whole, day with such power, and accordingly indiand after the country was irrevocably com- cated to them that they must change that mitted to that portion of the policy in policy. Not only did he do that, but he which the hon. gentleman was more par- actually invited the Government to conticularly interested, to take such a course sider whether they could not discover as that now proposed? The late Govern- some local or sectional objects upon which ment acting in good faith in this matter this money might be expended rather than obtained the necessary information with on the Baie Verte Canal. What would regard to this work, and were on the very be thought in Ontario if it was proposed eve of asking for tenders, when at the to this House that instead of spending the instance of the Minister of Marine and money required for the enlargement of the Fisheries and gentlemen associated with Welland Canal it should be spent for sechim from New Brunswick, the Govern- tional objects, and by this means secure ment consented to allow a dispute about the defeat of that project? Yet, the prothe route to be submitted to a disinterested position of the hon. member for South engineer and finally to the Chief Engineer Bruce was precisely similar. A more of the Public Works Department. He corrupt and immoral proposition was did not envy the position of the Minister never proposed to Parliament. He of Marine and Fisheries on this question. was astonished that the First Minister That gentleman stood immediately and of the Crown did not feel more what he personally responsible for thus trifling owed to the high position he occupied, that with one of the great public works he should recede from it and allow any of this country. At his earnest gentleman, however important, able or inappeal the late Government postponed fluential, to dictate to the Treasury Benches asking for tenders, and placing the work of this country what the public policy should under contract before Parliament met. be. It was humiliating to see any GovernDid the hon. gentleman delay the work ment driven to the position in which the then simply for the purpose of burking hon. member for South Bruce had placed it altogether? The present Government them. He left the responsibility of it to when they came into power declared that the Minister of Marine, and the Minister their policy was, as it was of that of the of Customs, but for whose interposition late Government, to carry out the whole this great work, so vitally important to a policy of the Canal Commissioners, which large portion of New Brunswick, and so had been endorsed by Parliament. Not important to the trade and commerce of only that, but a sum of money was placed the country from one end to the other, in the estimates for this work, and it was would at this moment have been half conannounced that tenders would be asked structed. for. The hon. gentleman having adopted a policy calculated to invite the hostility of every interested section of the country, still found it was all insufficient to enable him with any prospect of success to have this work defeated by his own friends. The hon. member for South Bruce then came to the front with a statement the most immoral, politically, that had ever been made in this House, and objected to the Premier carrying out the policy which he had announced to the House, and sugHon. Mr. Tupper. Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE said the Government accepted the responsibility. He never yet heard, in all the audacious speeches the hon. gentleman made, anything more audacious than the one to which the House had just listened. The hon. member presumed to lecture the Government on political morality and the maintenance of proper dignity. The hon. member had asserted it was a farce to bring down these estimates year after year. Who commenced it? The hon. gentleman with out the report of an engineer, without the, est. With reference to his statement that report of a single expert, without a particle there was not information in the departof knowledge on the subject, in his gross ment to warrant the Government to ignorance placed a sum in the estimates to undertake the work, the hon. gentleman construct a work of which he knew nothing. should accept it or apply somewhere else What course did the hon. gentleman pro- for information. pose to justify himself by now? The Canal Commissioners reported on it, as a whole, favorably. And who were these Canal Commissioners? The first was Mr. Hon. Mr. TUPPER said an engineer had been employed four years on the work. Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE said he had been a year and a half employed by the present Government. Hon. Mr. TUPPER Said be was willing to let the engineer say whether there was not information enough in the Department already to commence the work. CALVIN of Kingston. Did the hon. gentle-only Hon. Mr. MACKENZIE invited the hon. member to bring the engineer to the bar of the House and prove it, and promised every possible facility, by sub-committee or otherwise, to make good his assertion. It was time there should be an end to these reckless denunciations of public men and members of this House, because they chose to express their deliberate opinions. When he (Mr. MACKENZIE) made a statement to the House as head of a department, he did so knowing that he was correct, and the engineers of the department would bear ont every wordhe said. He expected early in January to have been able before the House rose to have obtained tenders and submitted them with the most explicit information regarding the work. He found, however, that the department, so far as this work was concerned, was in a state of utter confusion; nothing had been done in regard to the matter, except to place a sum in the estimates in order to deceive the people of Cumberland and of New Brunswick about election time. And yet the hon. member chose to rise in his place and make a passionate appeal to his following in order to make an attack upon the Government. He would say nothing about the reproaches cast against other hon. members, and when he held out, as he had to-night, the impression, with a view to form that impression on the public mind, that this project was opposed by Ontario members, it was necessary to call attention to the fact that no Ontario member said a word about the matter the other night. The discussion was entirely left, and in his opinion properly left, altogether to the members for the Maritime Provinces. |