perfuafion, and understanding it as a matter of course, that before the remaining fupplies were granted, he would have laid his plan before the house. That if they had not thought fo, they would not have given their fupport to measures, which it seemed now they were not to be acquainted with. That it looked as if it were meant that they should vote the estimates firft, and hear the reasons afterwards; or in other words, that the house fhould begin with a divifion; and end with a debate. They faid, that in looking for information, they did not mean a few fcraps of garbled and mutilated papers; but that verbal and official information, which they thought it the minifters duty to impart to parliament. That it was particularly neceffary they should receive information as to the perfons who were to be appointed as Commiffioners in America, and the nature and extent of their commiffion, that parliament might be enabled to judge, whether they were men fit to be entrusted with fo important a negociation, and whether the terms they carried out, were confiftent with the dignity of GreatBritain to offer, and the intereft of the Americans to receive.

One of the country gentlemen was fo earnest in this defire of information, and fo picqued at finding no difpofition in the minifter to give the fatisfaction which he required, that he attempted to break up the committee without its coming to any refolution, by moving, "that the chairman fhould quit the chair," which was feconded by another gentleman under the fame defcription.

Though the minifter did not

think it prudent, or was not prepared to give any direct or explicit anfwer, he, however, thought it neceffary to do fomething to keep that party in temper. He said, that the commiffion to be fent, would be in conformity to the intimation given from the throne; that the gentlemen need not make themselves uneafy, under the apprehenfion that any treaty of conceffion would be agreed to without the confent of parliament; but that it would be neceffary to know upon what grounds the Americans would treat, before the powers fufficient to ratify what the Commiffioners might think expedient, were derived from parliament. When the terms that America was willing to fubmit to, were in a ftate proper to be laid before the houfe, that, in his opinion, would be the proper time to take the sense of parliament on previous communications, and leave it to judge of the alternative, whether the offers of America could be accepted with honour, or whether we ought to reduce them to a ftate of obedience, however difficult or hazardous the undertaking.

In the further profecution of the fubject, the oppofition infifted, that the estimates were under-rated in fuch a degree, as to afford no clue whereby to form any judgment of the extent of the expences. That the proposed force of 25,000 men, was totally inadequate to the purposes of abfolute coercion. This was fupported by the opinion of a great general officer, who had long been in administration, and who declared it in the most unreferved terms; the other military gentlemen prefent were called upon to declare their diffent, if they

thought

thought otherwife; but they all continued filent. The mixt fyftem of war and conciliation was reprefented as highly improper. The measure adopted, whether of peace or war, should be clear, fimple, and decided, not involved in doubt, perplexity, and darkness. If war was refolved, and it was determined to compel America to fubmiffion, let the means of coercion be fuch, as will, to a moral certainty, infure fuccefs. The force employed must be able to command terms, or it does nothing. If on the contrary, peace is really wished for, and terms of conciliation are to be propofed, your propofitions ought to be fo clear as to be obvious to every common understanding, and fo fimple as to baffle the powers of chicanery.

On the other fide it was faid, that the force propofed, when its operations were directed to fpecific fervices, and fupported by a formidable fleet, would be fully fufficient for the purpose, and fuch as all America could not with ftand; nor was it probable, that they would enter into fo arduous a contest, when terms were held out to them at the very inftant, which would fully preferve their rights. The idea of fimple war, or fimple conceffion, was ftrongly controverted. It was faid that a conqueft over our own fubjects, was neither fought nor defired. That it was our intereft, as it was our wish, to reclaim, not to destroy or enflave. That in the prefent ftate of things in America, this defirable object could only be obtained by fuch an armament as would command respect, ftrike an awe into the factious, and enforce a fub

miffion to the conciliatory terms which we propofed, if coercion became abfolutely neceffary. And that either to withdraw the force we already had there, or to leave it expofed to the infults and danger of a greater on the fide of the rebels, would not only be in the highest degree difgraceful to ourfelves, but would, in its confequences, be equally ruinous to both countries.

A gentleman in office, but who has for feveral years been confidered as poffeffing much more real than oftenfible power, departed totally from thefe temperate ideas of conduct which the minifter profeffed, and on which he valued himself. He was of opinion, that all attempts of conciliation would be fruitlefs: obferved, that at any rate, a number of terms were to be made, and fecurities given, before conciliation could be obtained. That terms of force were the meafures chalked out by his Majesty in the fpeech; attended, however, with conditions of conciliation, and gracious offers of forgiveness and protection. On this foundation, the prefent vote on the eftimates was propofed; but if premature explanations were defired; if the gentlemen, who had piedged themfelves to fupport thofe meafures, had altered their minds, or had withdrawn their confidence from the King's fervants, he faw no poffible way to remedy matters but by a change of adminiftration. He, however, animadverted feverely on the cowardice of declining the conteft, almoft in the very outfet, after their having gone fuch lengths in bringing matters to that crifis.

This being confidered as the language

fome which were not publicly thought of. Whether the unhappy ftate of American affairs had difgufted the Earl of Dartmouth with the office of conducting them, or that government imagined a more auftere and inflexible character, with their natural concomitant a determinate conduct, were neceffary to restore peace and order, however it was, that nobleman Nov. 10th. now quitted the American fecretary fhip, and received the privy feal, which had been held by the Duke of Grafton.

The arduous task of conducting the American department was repofed in Lord George Sackville Germaine. The principal attachment of that noble Lord had been to Mr. Grenville. After Mr. Grenville's death, indeed, he continued for fome time firm on his former ground; and did not join in that defection from the minority which immediately followed that event. But he began at length to flacken in oppofition. He fell in with adminiftration in the proceedings against the EaftIndia Company in 1773; and took a full and decided part in all the coercive measures which had been pursued against the Americans, during the prefent troubles, His connections with Mr. Grenville probably made him fupport with more zeal and steadiness the highest claims of parliamentary authority; and as he was generally esteemed a man of business, and an able debater, he was fought for at a time, when the extraordinary powers in the fame line, upon the other fide, feemed, notwithstanding the fuperiority of numbers, not a little to diftrefs adminiftration. It will

not be conceived,, that this appointment ftrengthened the hope or increafed the fatisfaction of thofe who held the opinion, that conciliatory measures could only bring the prefent troubles to a speedy and happy conclufion.

At the fame time, the Earl of Rochford having retired from public bufinefs, was fucceeded as Secretary of State for the Southern department by Lord Weymouth, who had continued out of employment fince his refignation on the affair of Falkland Island. And a few days after, Lord Lyttelton, " who had been diftinguifhed at the opening of the feffion by the feverity of his ftrictures upon adminiftration, was called to the Privy Council, and appointed Chief Juftice in Eyre beyond Trent. Lord Pelham was alfo appointed to the great wardrobe, and Lord Afburnham, Keeper of the Stole.

The affair of the petition from the Congrefs, which Mr. Pena had lately prefented to his Majefty, had frequently been brought up in both houfes by the oppofition, both as affording a ground of conciliation, and fubject of reproach to the minifters, for their total neglect of that and all other applications of the fame nature, A copy of the petition being, however, laid before the Lords among other papers on the 7th of November, a noble Duke in oppofition obferved, that he faw Mr. Peon below the bar, and he moved, that he might be examined, in order to eftablish the authenticity of the petition, before they entered into any debates upon its contents, thereby to obviate the doubts, which might otherwife probably arife upon that head, and be the

means

means of interrupting their proceedings.

As the Lords in adminiftration were well aware, that the views of the noble mover and his friends, went farther than the authenticity of the petition, and extended to the laying before the houfe all the information with respect to America, which they could draw from a perfon fo thoroughly mafter of the fubject as Mr. Penn, and not being at all difpofed that fuch matters fhould now be brought forward, they used every means to prevent or defeat the examination. They objected to the motion on the fubject of order; on its informality; on its want of precedent; being contrary to their eftablished mode of proceeding; that the bringing in of extraneous matter by furprize, and breaking in upon their moft ferious and important deliberations, by fuddenly calling their attention off to the examination of witneffes, and to new fubjects of difcuffion, would be destructive of that order and gravity which had always diftinguished their proceedings.

They alfo contended, that this measure would eftablish a most pernicious precedent, as it would neceffarily follow, that every petition, from whatever quarter of the glube, must be accompanied by the evidence' to ettablish its authenticity. -They obferved, that improper questions might be asked, and fuch anfwers drawn from Mr. Penn, as might tend to prejudice him with refpect to his private fortune and affairs in America; that his evidence might have the fame effect with refpect to others, who were alfo friends to government in America, and who by a public expo

fure of their private conduct in its favour, would be liable to personal danger, and ruin to their fortunes. They alfo infifted, that as the evidence, let it turn out as it may, would be only ex parte, the house could not found any refolution upon it; nor could it be prefumed, that the fingle teftimony of an individual, however refpectable the character may be, could at all influence their conduct or opinion, in questions of fuch great national and political import. To prevent, however, every pretence for the enquiry, they offered to admit the authenticity of the petition without any proof.

On the other fide, they faid, that the objections as to order were fo trifling, as to be unworthy of their time and attention; that the propofed examination was, however, fully fupportable upon that ground, as well as in point of precedent. They offered to tie themfelves down as to the queftions to be put, and that the Lords, who oppofed the meafure, fhould object to any which they did not approve. And they lamented, in the most pathetic terms, the dif pofition which they faw in the house, to fhut out every fpecies of information relative to America, to continue to the laft in darkness, and to rush headlong themselves, and plunge the nation along with them, into inevitable ruin and deftruction. That this was the more furprizing, and the more lamentable, as the fatal confequences which had already proceeded from a fimilar conduct, were fo fenfibly felt at this very inftant, as to convulfe the empire through all its parts.

The motion being rejected upon a divi